Well, today continues yesterday's topic of the quality of German armor. This article was sent to us by Yuxiang sauce, and after reading it, we thought it was very interesting and sent it out.

Source:http://ftr./2014/02/06/on－german－armour/

Source: ↗ The author of this article is EnsignExpandable, and only represents the author's own views.

Please indicate the source and the original author for reprinting. Awhileago,IwroteaQAspecialonSoviettankarmour.SincethenIhavegottenperiodicrequeststodoasimilarspecialonGermantankarmour.Initially,Ididnotintendtowritesuchanarticle, butdutycalls. However,thisisnoordinaryarticle.

Not so long ago, I did a QA focused on Soviet armor. Since then I've been getting requests from people who want me to do a similar, but with a QA on German armor. At first, I didn't want to write it, but I had to write it. However, this is not an ordinary article.

Usually,archivematerialsdonotparticularlysurpriseme. Iseea“that’sinteresting”hereandthere,maybea“huh,Ididn’tknowthat”. I’veevencometotermswithridiculousthingsthathappenwhenyoutrytocomparereportsfromthetwosidesinvolved. Butthis,thisissomethingunprecedented. ManythingsIhavewrittenshockedmyreaders,butthisdiscoveryshockedevenme.

Normally, things like archives don't surprise me. I'm always looking for "interesting" content all over the place, and occasionally I'll have a "yes, I don't know about this." Personally, I have come across many examples of very strange situations when comparing the reports of the two parties involved in an incident. But the following is unprecedented. Many of the things I have written have shocked my readers, but the following findings have shocked even myself.

Itallstarted,asitusuallydoes,withanargumentonaninternetforum. Asitoftenhappens,wewerediscussingaDTICdocument,specifically“MetallurgicalExaminationofArmorandWeldedJointsfromtheSideofaGermanPzKw(Panther)Tank“,tobeprecise. Thisreportsayslotsofthingsonewouldnormallyexpecttoseeinareportaboutlate－warGermanarmour:“Thesteelqualityratingwas“D”… whichisborderlineacceptable”,“thefracturewa**tremelybrittleinnature,withabrightflatcrystallinesurface”,“inferiortoughness, asevidencedbybrittlefracturesandlowimpactresistance”,“extremelypoorshockproperties”,etc,etc. IfyoulookedintoGermanarmourinanyseriousmanner,you’veseenitallbefore. However,WoTforumsposterDaigensuibroughtsomethingunexpectedtomyattention, aclaimbyAmericanintelligencethatthequalityofGermanarmourdidnotdeterioratefrom1942to1945.Ididnotbelievemyeyes.Howcouldthatbe? SurelyGermanarmourin1942wasnotasbadasitwasin1945? Let’stakeatripbackintime,throughmanyyearsofarmoursamples,toseewhereitallwentwrong.

As usual, the incident was provoked in an online forum. As usual, we are discussing a DCIT (Defense Technical Information Center) dossier, to be precise, "Experiments on the solder joints on the sides of the German Leopard tank (known as the Panther tank in the national uniform) and the metallurgy of the armor". Much is said in the report that can be seen in the general report on the armor of post-war Germany: \"The quality of the armor is" D "...... That is, the lowest acceptable degree", "the armor itself is very fragile, the surface is bright and flat (smooth) crystal", "extremely poor (impact) resistance", and so on. If you look at German armor from any serious angle, you should have seen these things before. However, Daigensui of the WOT forum came up with something that I did not expect, namely: the US Intelligence Agency stated that the quality of German armor did not deteriorate in 1942~1945. It blew my mind, what the hell is going on? Was the quality of the armor of the Germans really better in 1942 than in 1945? Let's go back in time and look at many years of armor samples to see what went wrong.

Theaforementionedreportisfrom1945,pasttheendofthewar. Let’srewindabitandlookataslightlyearlierstudy,“MetallurgicalExaminationofa3－1/4″ThickarmorPlatefromaGermanPzKwV(Panther)Tank“,writteninJanuaryof1945.Notsurprisingly, it’sfullofthesamereviews:“poortoughness”,“resultingfractureexhibitedaroughcrystallinesurface”,etc. Allright,butthatwasonlyafewmonthsprior,let’sgobackevenfurther.

The above report was written after the war in 1945 (by the US Intelligence Agency). Let's go back a little further and look at an earlier study, "Experiments on the Solder Joints on the Sides of the German Leopard Tank (known as the Panther Tank in the National Service) and the Metallurgy of Armor", which was written in January 1945. Not surprisingly, the report has similar comments: "very poor hardness", "the flat surface used for the test shows a rough, transparent surface after testing", and so on. Okay, but this is just something from a few months ago. We continued to walk back.

InAugustof1944,theSovietscapturedashinynewGermantank,theTigerII(dependingonwhoyouask). Obviously,theSovietwerecuriousaboutthetank’sthickarmour,anditwastestedextensively(courtesyoflitl－bro). TheSovietfindingsarelargelythesame:“Thefrontplatesofthehullandturret,asdemonstratedinthetrials,arelowquality. Whenthearmourwasnotpenetrated(dented),thearmourformedlargecracks,andlargefragmentsbrokeofftherearside.” Don’tworryaboutthe“front”qualifier,thesidearmourisdiscussedinalatersectionofthereport.“ Duetoadecreaseinthearmourquality,andduetorelativelyweaksidearmour,thetankisvulnerabletodomestic85,100,122,and152mmguns,aswellastheAmerican76.2mmgun”. Thegunneryreportisalsoquitecriticalofthearmour:“ThequalityofthearmouroftheTigerBdroppedradicallycomparedtothequalityofarmouroftheTigerH,Panther,andFerdinand”. Translationsofpartsofthesereportsareavailablehere,here,here,here,andhere.

In August 1944, the Soviets captured a brand new German tank, the King Tiger (depending on who you ask) (inside the link is a letter calling the King Tiger "Tiger ImperialTank", or "Tiger Royal Tank"). Apparently, the Soviets were interested in the tank's heavy armor, and the tank was extensively tested (thanks to litl-bro's kindness) (a copy of the Russian PDF document is included in the link). The Soviets found something similar: "The frontal armor plates of the body and turret, as shown in the experiments, were of poor quality." When the armor is not penetrated (dents appear), large cracks appear in the armor, and fragments fall on the back of the armor plates. Don't be limited by the word "frontal", side armor is mentioned later in the report. "Given the deterioration in armor quality and weak side armor, this tank is vulnerable to our domestic 85, 100, 122 and 152 mm guns, as well as the American 76.2 mm guns." The shooting report (also Mao Wen's scanned picture) also criticized the armor: "Compared with the Tiger H, the armor quality of the Tiger B has fundamentally decreased compared with the Tiger H, the Leopard tank (called the Panther tank in the national uniform), and Ferdinand." The report can be found here, here, here, and here.

Theaforementionedreportisfrom1945,pasttheendofthewar. Let’srewindabitandlookataslightlyearlierstudy,“MetallurgicalExaminationofa3－1/4″ThickarmorPlatefromaGermanPzKwV(Panther)Tank“,writteninJanuaryof1945.Notsurprisingly, it’sfullofthesamereviews:“poortoughness”,“resultingfractureexhibitedaroughcrystallinesurface”,etc. Allright,butthatwasonlyafewmonthsprior,let’sgobackevenfurther.

The above report was written after the war in 1945 (by the US Intelligence Agency). Let's go back a little further and look at an earlier study, "Experiments on the Solder Joints on the Sides of the German Leopard Tank (known as the Panther Tank in the National Service) and the Metallurgy of Armor", which was written in January 1945. Not surprisingly, the report has similar comments: "very poor hardness", "the flat surface used for the test shows a rough, transparent surface after testing", and so on. Okay, but this is just something from a few months ago. We continued to walk back.

Ohhey,thereitis,radicaldropinquality! Couldthisbeit? Imean,in1944,itwouldmakesenseforGermanarmourqualitytodrop.Theiralliesareleavingonebyone,theirfactoriesarebeingbombed,theWesternAlliesaremovingupthroughFrance, theSovietscrossedtheiroldbordersandareonGermanterritory.Butwe’renotsatisfiedwithconjecture! Forwardandonwardbackward,to1943!

Aha, there it is! Decline from a fundamental degree! Is this it? I mean, in 1944 it seems plausible that in 1944 there was a decline in the quality of the armor of the Germans. One by one, their allies were withdrawing from the stage, their factories were being bombed, the Allies to the west were advancing through France, and the Soviets had crossed their borders and set foot on German soil. But conjecture alone will not satisfy us! Let's move on and backwards to 1943!

May,1943.TheRedArmyhasseenanumberTigertanksbythispoint,anddragsonetotheprovinggroundstoseejustwhatmakesthemtick. I’llskiptotheconclusions:“Asaresultofhitsfrom57,85,and122mmguns,thearmourcracksandfragmentsbreakoff.… Theweldingseamsareveryfragile,andaredestroyedwhenthearmourishitbyarmourpiercingshells.” Ifyougoandclickthelinksabove,you’llseethenittygrittypicturesanddetails,butthenatureofthedamageisthesameastotheKingTiger:burstweldingseams,crystallinecracks, breachesmuchlargerthanacaliberinsize. ThequalityofthearmourontheKingTigermighthavegonedown,butitdidn’tgodownthatfarcomparedtoitspredecessor. Seemsthatwehaveabittogobeforewefindwhatwe’relookingfor.

In May 1943, the Red Army of the Soviet Union had already seen a number of Tigers by this time, and they also towed a Tiger to the test site to figure out what made them make this choice. Let me jump straight to the conclusion: "The result after firing at 57, 85, 122 mm was as follows, the armor cracked, and fragments flew out...... Wire welds appear to be very fragile and are destroyed when armor is attacked by armor-piercing shells. "If you click on the links above, you'll see a lot of pictures and details of the holes, but the properties are the same as the King Tiger test results: weld wires that crack, crystalline cracks, notches that are much larger than the caliber of the shells. The quality of the Tiger King's armor may have decreased, but not by that much compared to its predecessors. It looks like we're going to have to go a while before we find what we're looking for

Evenfurtherback,to1942. ManyLend－Lease,domestic,andcapturedgunsaretestedagainstGermanvehicles.Here’swheresomethingstrangehappens. TheStuGthatisbeingtestedperformsverywell.Nocracksafterbeingshotatwitha45mmgun,penetrationsonlyslightlylargerthanacaliberinsize. ThenthePzIIIisswappedin,andtheperformanceisabsolutelyabysmal. Hugecracksfromthesameanaemic45mmpeashooter,thefrontarmourplatefallsoff,breachesupto120mminsizeform. Whenthe76mmguncomesintoplay,theresultsareevenworse:asinglepenetratingshotshattersameter－longsectionofarmour. Breachesincreaseupto240mm.ThePzIVdoesn’tdomuchbetter. Ifyouwant,detailsarefoundhereandhere,aswellastheabovelinks. AsidefromtheStuG,thearmourqualityislow,whichismentionedbyMalyshevhimselfinanotecomplainingabouttheshapeofSovietshells:“ Therearetworeasonswhywedonotneedtoworryaboutthearmourpiercingpropertiesofourshells.Oneisthatour45and76mmgunsareverypowerful.TheotheristhatGermantanksareweaklyarmoured( 40－50mminthefront,30mmonthesides),andGermanarmourisofpoorquality.”

Continuing back in time, back to 1942. Many of the weapons that passed land lease, domestic, as well as captured, were tested on German bodies. But something strange is happening here. The three bursts performed well in the test, and there were no cracks after being attacked by the 45mm gun, and the gap in the shell after the breakdown was slightly larger than the caliber of the shell. As soon as tank three came into play, the situation became very bad. The same insignificant 45mm toy gun made a big crack in the body of Number Three, and the frontal armor plate fell off, and the gap (pierced by the shell) was about 120mm. When the test weapon was replaced with a 76mm gun, the results were even worse: a shell that pierced through the armor directly shattered a meter of armor. The breakdown notch is about 240mm. And the performance of the number four was not much better. If you want to see it, you can find more details here and here. With the exception of the three protrusions, the quality of the armor was generally low, and Malyshev himself mentioned this in his notes complaining about the shape of the Soviet ammunition: "There are two reasons why we do not need to worry about the properties of our AP shells. One is that our 45mm and 76mm guns are powerful enough. The other is that the protection of German tanks was very poor (40-50mm on the front, 30mm on the sides), and the quality of German armor was terrible. ”

We’reonaroll,solet’skeepgoing. Inhismemoirs,“MemoriesofaSoldier”,GuderianwritessomereasonswhyGermanengineers,a**citedastheywereaboutcapturedT－34s,couldnotproduceacopy. Amongthosereason,thereisonewecaseabout:“… ourhardenedsteel,whosequalitywasdroppingduetoalackofnaturalresources,wasinferiortotheRussians’hardenedsteel.” TheeventsherecallsinthissectionhappenedinNovember1941,afewmonthsafterBarbarossastarted,longbeforeanykindofsignificantdamagetoGermanfactoriescausedbyAlliedbombings.

Well, that's it, and keep going. In his memoir "Memories of a Soldier", Guderian writes about some German engineers who expressed their excitement about the capture of a T-34, but the reason why they could not make a replica. Among these reasons, there is one we are looking for: "...... Our hardened steel, whose quality has deteriorated due to the lack of natural resources, is worse than that of the USSR. In this part of the memoir, all the events it mentions took place in November 1941, a few months before the Barbarossa Project, and before the Allied bombing could inflict any effective damage on Germany.

Whystopat1941? Let’sgowayback,tothestartofthewar. AsapartoftheagreementbetweentheUSSRandGermany,theUSSRgotacopyofGermany’slatestandgreatestintanktechnology. Ofcourse,theytestedeverymoleculeofthetanktheyreceived. Theresultswerebad.Reallybad.TheGermanarmourfailedcatastrophicallywhensubjectedtotheabsoluteminimumconditionforacceptancebySovietengineers.Theyweresoshocked, theymadeanidenticalsectionofarmouroutofSovietsteel,justtomakesurethattherewasn’tanythingaboutthearmour’sshapethatmadeitcrumbletobits.

Why stop in 1941? Let's go back to the very beginning of the war. As part of the agreement between Germany and the Soviet Union, the Soviet Union received a copy of the latest German technology. Of course, they tested every part of the tank they got their hands on. It turned out pretty bad, really bad. The German armor, when compared with the acceptable bottom limits of Soviet engineers, achieved a catastrophic defeat. They (Soviet engineers) were also shocked that they had made the same thing using Soviet steel, and it was only to confirm that it was not the shape of the armor that led to such a poor result.

Thiswasarmourmadebeforethewar,beforeAlliedbombings,beforeanylackofvitalmetals. ThiswasGermanindustry’sfinesthour,andtheiroutputwasunacceptablebythestandardsoftheSovietmilitary.Evenwithoutanyexcuses, themythicalKruppsteeldoesnotmeasureuptoIzhor’sproduct.

This is armor made before World War II, before the bombing of the Allies, before the emergence of a shortage of steel to any degree. This was also the best period for German industry, and the results they achieved were unacceptable even to the Soviet military industry. The mysterious Krupp Steel can no longer make any excuse for not being able to compare with Izhor's products.

“ButEnsign!” someofyoumaycomplain,“Doylehimselfsaidthat30mmofGermanarmourwasworth60mmofotherarmouronOverlord’sblog!” Thepeoplethatclaimthisaren’trememberingthespecificpostverywell.30mmofhighqualityGermanarmourwasworthasmuchas60mmofCzechoslovakianarmour, whichwasn’tparticularlyamazingeither. FromtheSoviettrialsofthePz38(t):“ThearmouroftheCzechoslovak“Praga”38Ttankisverybrittle,fragmentseasily,andgiveslargecracks.” Armourthat’ssuperiortothatisn’tparticularlydifficulttoobtain. HealsostatesthatqualityofGermanweldingdidnotdeterioratethroughoutthewar.Ifyoufollowthearticleslinkedabove,thisistrue, theirweldingseamsburstfrompenetratingandnonpenetratinghitsin1942justaswellastheydoin1945.

"But the second lieutenant!" Someone will complain like that. "Doyle, he himself said on Overlord's blog that 30mm German armor is as protective as other 60mm armor!" Those who said that must not have remembered that post well. 30mm of high-quality German armor is equivalent to almost 60mm of Czechoslovak armor, and of course, Czechs are not a good thing. Here is an excerpt from the Soviet test report for the Pz38(t): "The Czechoslovak "Prague" 38T tank was fragile, easily falling apart, and the rifts were large. "It is not difficult to surpass the quality of the armor of the Czechs. At the same time, he stated that the quality of the welded wires of the Germans did not deteriorate during the war. If you read the articles in the links above, you will see that this is true. In 1942 and 1945, their wires burst straight open with and without breakdown.

Thiswasarmourmadebeforethewar,beforeAlliedbombings,beforeanylackofvitalmetals. ThiswasGermanindustry’sfinesthour,andtheiroutputwasunacceptablebythestandardsoftheSovietmilitary.Evenwithoutanyexcuses, themythicalKruppsteeldoesnotmeasureuptoIzhor’sproduct.

This is armor made before World War II, before the bombing of the Allies, before the emergence of a shortage of steel to any degree. This was also the best period for German industry, and the results they achieved were unacceptable even to the Soviet military industry. The mysterious Krupp Steel can no longer make any excuse for not being able to compare with Izhor's products.

Now,I’mnotsayingthatallGermanarmourwasbad. FromthatStuGtestedabove,youcanclearlyseethatnotallGermanarmourwasthatabysmal.ButwhatyoucanalsoseeisthatGermanarmourvariedwildlyinquality(seealsothe“soft”BritishTiger) ,leaningtowardsthebadmoresothanthegood. ThereisnomagicalKruppSteelthatissomehowsuperiortoall(orevensome)steelfromtheAllies.

Of course, I'm not saying that all German armor was of poor quality. As can be seen from the above-mentioned experiments on the three protrusions, not all German armor was so bad. But you should also see that German armor was really uneven in quality (go look at the "soft" British Tiger) and was more inclined to the bad side than the good side. There is no such thing as magic Krupp metal that is better than all (or some) Allied steel.